2842: A Rocket Scientist's Journey: Masha Petrova on Overcoming Stereotypes in Tech

[00:00:00] In today's fast pace world, where technology continues to intertwine with almost every

[00:00:07] facet of our lives. How often do you pause to consider the forces propelling these

[00:00:13] advancements forward? And by that I mean everything from the wireless networks

[00:00:18] that invisibly connect us to the very satellites orbiting our planet. The silent yet

[00:00:24] omnipresent radio frequency technology that underpins much of our modern existence. But hey,

[00:00:31] I think most of us tech it for granted. I know I do. But today I want to not only shine

[00:00:37] a light on that but also the visionaries behind these innovations. What drives them to push

[00:00:43] the boundaries of what is technologically possible? So in today's episode of The Tech Talks

[00:00:49] Daily Podcast, we're going to peel back the layers of the complexity that surrounds these

[00:00:54] technologies and reveal the human stories at its very core. And today I've got the huge

[00:01:00] pleasure of hosting Masha Petraova. She's the CEO of Null Space. I also have a trial

[00:01:07] blaze in the aerospace engineering field. But her journey is one of defiance, curiosity

[00:01:14] and innovation. From harbing a diss taste for mathematics to becoming a pivotal figure

[00:01:20] in rocket science and leading Null Space's charging revolutionising our Earth simulation

[00:01:25] technology. This is one of those stories that challenges all preconceptions about who

[00:01:30] can be a scientist and what it means to innovate. Now before I get today's guests on,

[00:01:36] it's time for me to mention the sponsors of Tech Talks Daily and in an era where digital

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[00:02:18] get started today by going to kiteworks.com. That's kiteworks.com where security makes

[00:02:25] sophistication. But now it's time to get today's guests on. So buckle up and hold on tight as I

[00:02:32] beam your ears all the way to California to hear more about this inspiring story.

[00:02:39] So a massive welcome to the show. Can I type on listening a little about who you are and what

[00:02:44] you do? I'm Yellow's a pleasure to be here so my name is Masha Petrova. I'm the CEO and co-founder

[00:02:50] of a company called NullSpace. NullSpace is based in California, United States. And we developed

[00:02:57] software for electrical engineers to help them simulate radio frequency technologies like

[00:03:03] antennas and radars. Well it's a pleasure to have you on the podcast. And before we even start

[00:03:07] talking about some of the great work that you're doing, when I was doing a little research on

[00:03:11] you before you came on the podcast today, I know you had a semi viral LinkedIn post recently. It's

[00:03:16] interesting to be a huge hit with the development community. Can you type on listening a little

[00:03:20] about that? Yeah. Thank you. You know what's funny is I have kids and I told my 11-year-old and 18-year-old

[00:03:28] that hey, I have a viral post that went viral on LinkedIn. First of all they're barely know what

[00:03:33] LinkedIn is. And then they said oh really they got so excited and they said can we see it? And I

[00:03:38] showed it to them with that like that's not viral. That's only 300 likes. That's like nothing.

[00:03:45] You're nobody on TikTok or Instagram. It's kind of funny how this world works but yes I

[00:03:53] wrote a post out of frustration really. So my background is in engineering. I have a page Z in

[00:03:58] our space engineer. I was a real engineer for a couple of years there before diving into the

[00:04:04] evil world of sales and marketing and staying there. And I spent about 20 years of my life in

[00:04:11] engineering software space meaning I led teams whether it's marketing or business development

[00:04:17] or wasn't engineer myself in companies that developed software for engineers electrical engineers

[00:04:24] mechanical engineers aerospace engineers. It's not something that you would think as super sexy space

[00:04:33] but is extremely important and needed because everything around us that's technology from the car

[00:04:38] that you get into and don't think two seconds about that carries you safely to your destination

[00:04:43] to the plane that you know it's hunk of metal that's flying through the sky to the bridge

[00:04:49] that you're driving over every day on a freeway right that doesn't collapse. All of that is built

[00:04:54] by engineers and engineers need tools and some of those tools are software tools. These are reliable

[00:05:01] very hard to develop software tools and that's my world. That's what I lived in. And I was getting

[00:05:08] frustrated because right now in the CEO as I mentioned at the start up we're raising venture capital

[00:05:14] and turns out it is very hard to raise venture capital for a very practical engineering

[00:05:23] the reliable and non-sexy type of company should we say. And so I was getting frustrated because

[00:05:31] there's been a whole world-wendobacquisitions in our space recently which hasn't happened before ever

[00:05:37] so these larger companies for example one company was called Ansys. Company most people have not

[00:05:43] heard of unless they're an engineer and if you are an engineer you definitely heard of it.

[00:05:47] It develops engineering software engineering tools that was recently acquired for 35 billion

[00:05:54] and the interesting part is 35 billion as an acquisition number is large enough but what's

[00:06:00] even more interesting they were acquired on I believe it was 16 times their revenue multiple

[00:06:07] meaning our avenue was only two billion each annually each year and they were acquired for 35

[00:06:13] billion by a company that has revenue of 8 billion. So and there's been a number of these

[00:06:19] acquisitions recently and so you know investors have been asking me like hey what's the deal with all

[00:06:25] these acquisitions in your space like we've never heard of them like we've no one's heard of these

[00:06:29] companies but what are they why are they selling for so much and I think the answer is that I've

[00:06:35] been seeing this space kind of going into this direction for a long time engineering tools are

[00:06:42] hard to develop again it's not like a AI app it's not Instacart it's not Facebook you can't just

[00:06:49] get a few developers to mock up a prototype in a month it takes years because engineers use those

[00:06:55] tools to build things that we use for safety right and and so it might take on the whole the

[00:07:04] acquisition space was maybe where finally in a space where the world is realizing at least

[00:07:09] these larger companies are realizing that hey engineering software is crucial for our

[00:07:14] infrastructure as humanity and as we're developing technologies faster and faster these engineering

[00:07:19] tools are going to be really needed and really important and so they're buying them up and there's

[00:07:25] that like much of them one of the reasons I invite you on the podcast today was to demystify

[00:07:31] engineering simulation every day I take a different topic and try putting in the language everyone

[00:07:36] can understand so with your extensive background in aerospace engineering I'm curious why do you see

[00:07:42] engineering simulation as a pivotal element for our technological future and how does no space can

[00:07:48] contribute to this vision I'm sure it's a topic that you're incredibly passionate about so can

[00:07:54] you demystify it forever on listening yes I am very passionate about it so the way you engineer

[00:08:02] something right think about a car a your refrigerator again a bridge built by civil engineers

[00:08:10] tall skyscraper that doesn't collapse during earthquake right like all these type of technologies

[00:08:16] are designed by engineers the way the engineering process works as a group of engineers or an engineer

[00:08:22] have an idea for development or something or they have customer requirements to develop some sort

[00:08:28] of technology and then the process starts right so there is some sort of idea then that idea has

[00:08:34] to be designed out usually designed in tools like CAD tools which is computer aided design tools

[00:08:42] and so that's how you would draft out or design out your ideas and engineer and then there's a

[00:08:48] whole slew of testing and validation that happens after that where certain things are tweaked

[00:08:53] and then they whatever product is tested then things are tweaked again the product is tested so

[00:08:58] that it you can test it against all kinds of conditions so that as you're driving in your car

[00:09:04] you might have an accident but I will be because of you not because the engines stop working right

[00:09:09] to get that level of reliability of technology it does really require very rigorous engineering

[00:09:14] process and so you could test things by building them in a laboratory and testing them in

[00:09:20] variety of ways right or mechanical properties chemical properties fluid dynamics all kinds of things

[00:09:26] or another way of testing which is developed in the recent maybe 50 40 years or so

[00:09:32] is to simulate the physics in a computer and to test whatever it is you're engineering in a

[00:09:39] computer right and that's where engineering simulation comes in so engineering simulation

[00:09:44] is a way for engineers to test their designs for reliability and all kinds of properties

[00:09:51] in a computer in a simulator as opposed to building a giant test rig for it that makes sense

[00:09:57] and so in no space we focus specifically on the electromagnetic part so we simulate

[00:10:03] electromagnetic and electromagnetic is sometimes called blood the black magic or the black

[00:10:08] arts of engineering because you can't see it but it's everywhere you know you and I are talking

[00:10:14] because of electromagnetic technology because of our f technology you know any any technology

[00:10:19] that communicates hardware that communicates with each other but there's no wires how's that happened

[00:10:24] there's stuff floating in air and that stuff is electromagnetic you know waves

[00:10:31] and that's how different technologies communicate with each other and we don't even think about it

[00:10:35] because you don't see it right like it's hard to really visualize um what is there and it's

[00:10:42] everywhere if you think about your your car is it becoming a computer now satellites are becoming

[00:10:47] computers you're you know with your smartwatch and the phone and phone alone has like five or seven

[00:10:54] antennas and then depending on the phone that you have you know it's got the bluetooth it's got the

[00:10:58] different types of antennas it's got the GPS all those things that are communicating with other things

[00:11:03] without wires um our our f technology and so we our software allows electrical engineers to design

[00:11:13] those kinds of products our f technology products and simulate how they're going to perform

[00:11:17] are you on tena or radar or other f technology will perform

[00:11:23] and simulate in the computer first before having to build it and test it many times over

[00:11:29] that makes sense 100% and I always try every day on this podcast to try and get people thinking

[00:11:36] differently about the world around them how they're surrounded by technology in their life

[00:11:40] their work and indeed world and given the exploding demand for RF technology and everything from

[00:11:47] agriculture to space exploration can you elaborate on on where this technology plays a critical

[00:11:54] role in our daily lives and some of the challenges that this demand might be presenting up because

[00:11:59] again for a lot of people they're blissfully unaware of this stuff right which which might

[00:12:03] frustrate you too it's true because there is so much engineering brain power you know PhD level

[00:12:11] engineers um brain power that goes into developing these technologies but you don't see them and

[00:12:17] you don't think about them in your everyday life but if we take something like very practical and

[00:12:21] simple like well I shouldn't say simple very practical and visible like a car let's say 50 years ago

[00:12:28] your car was a mechanical and fluid dynamics type of uh technology right there were gears that were

[00:12:37] you know moving other gears and that's how the engine worked there was obviously the internal

[00:12:42] combustion engine and there's some chemistry happening there and some fluid dynamics

[00:12:46] but that was it there was mechanics and there was fluid dynamics and now we think about cars

[00:12:51] cars now have you know radars that could see things at night so autonomous vehicles right the GPS

[00:12:58] in your car that tells you if you're in an accident all of a sudden you can instantly send a note

[00:13:03] you know and have someone come or not a note but a message and have someone come rescue you that sent

[00:13:09] through RF signal um the way the cars see other things or or uh see other cars in a autonomous

[00:13:17] vehicle type of situation that's all RF technology so your car is becoming more and more of a

[00:13:24] RF device a more and more computer if you want to think about it then just a mechanical and a fluid

[00:13:29] dynamics thing and that's happening with everything that's happening with airspace with satellites with

[00:13:35] planes with communications with all these technologies that you know are well established

[00:13:40] and then there is a whole slew of new industries that we didn't even think about again 56

[00:13:46] years ago right like you're watching measuring your blood pressure and sending it to or the

[00:13:52] or ring right or sending it to your phone with all kinds of statistics that it's sending it through

[00:13:57] the air through the radio frequency uh type of technology and so there's a whole new

[00:14:07] markets that have that were born based on RF technology and electromagnetic

[00:14:14] everyone knows about the explosion of AI and oh you've had episodes here obviously talking

[00:14:18] about AI quite a bit AI consumes chips right that's how AI works so there's a big proliferation

[00:14:28] of chips there's a conversation of where these chips are being made and you know all storm of

[00:14:33] conversations on that at a certain frequency if one of those chips is actually an RF device as well

[00:14:40] so RF is literally penetrating our lives at every every possible way and so something that your

[00:14:49] listeners could think about is just look around the room look at you know what you're wearing on your

[00:14:53] wrists look at your phone your computer just your smart coffee maker right that is making

[00:15:01] Bobby is certain time and sending data somewhere your air conditioner your nest nest uh

[00:15:06] you know heat controller or air conditioner that's sending data through Bluetooth to

[00:15:11] when those were all of that is just RF waves loading through the air all around you

[00:15:18] making all these technologies work absolutely love that and one of the things I always also

[00:15:24] try and do on these podcasts as you know is try and find out more about the the guest origin story

[00:15:30] one of the things that attracted me to you was how you took this creative path to rocket science

[00:15:35] because your journey from a creative individual who dislikes math to becoming a rocket scientist

[00:15:41] is truly inspiring so can you share how you navigated that transformation and what motivated

[00:15:47] you to pursue aerospace engineering because I feel there's a bit of a story here right

[00:15:52] oh yeah there's definitely a story so I am not a traditional engineer you know as I

[00:16:00] mentioned engineers are all most of the time if you think about a stereotypical engineer

[00:16:05] they're very detailed oriented they're very thorough um they're good at math typically right

[00:16:12] I am typically not good at any of those things I have a lot more of uh geo the ADD brain

[00:16:18] I think a lot a lot more in a higher level I can focus my attention when I really want to

[00:16:25] and so in marketing for example I get very into details and on on the branding side of things

[00:16:30] and colors and fonts and all that kind of stuff uh which is kind of funny but on the engineering

[00:16:36] side of things it was essentially brute force that got me into grad school so I was born in Russia

[00:16:44] Moscow back in the Soviet Union days I grew up on Soviet Union science fiction which was really

[00:16:49] cool and then my grandfather was an aerospace engineer pretty high up in uh the space race

[00:16:56] side of things on the Soviet Union side and so I grew up around space and it was portrayed

[00:17:03] in a really really cool way and again growing up in Soviet Union there wasn't like

[00:17:07] the best childhood should we say there is a lot of things missing like food sometimes

[00:17:15] you know I had like one one pair of pants one skirt growing up like one pair of shoes um

[00:17:22] so so life itself was pretty limiting but the science fiction world opened up this really

[00:17:28] really exciting unlimited world of possibilities of travel to different planets and the kind

[00:17:34] of life that I could have and I think that's where it just kind of hooked me as a child and so I

[00:17:37] decided I was going to be a cosmonaut at the time and then moving to S I was going to become an

[00:17:42] astronaut um and to become an astronaut I knew that one of the fastest paths in was to become an

[00:17:48] engineer and so that was really my path into engineering is uh you know I was gonna make it work

[00:17:56] whether I like math or not and so you know math came harder to me than anybody else I had to work

[00:18:01] harder than anybody else I never had straight A's um it was hard I was forcing the part of my

[00:18:08] brain to work that usually doesn't doesn't and then grad school was easier because there were

[00:18:17] things that uh I basically just kind of hacked my way through engineering in the way where I found

[00:18:23] things that work for me and that I enjoy so teamwork solving hard problems um I'm pretty

[00:18:30] systematic in a lot of ways so like finding satisfaction from solving these like pages and pages of

[00:18:36] equations um systematically worked for me and then once you get into grad school you know you get

[00:18:43] into higher math which is a lot more conceptual there's a lot less numbers it's a lot more visual

[00:18:48] yeah mostly letters like pages and pages of of equations with letters in them and that was great

[00:18:55] because it was a lot more a lot more visual and that worked for me and you know linear algebra was

[00:19:01] much easier to understand than I don't know trigonometry in high school um and that's how I ended

[00:19:09] up sort of here what an incredibly cool story what about your dreams of becoming an astronaut is

[00:19:15] that still there I mean William Schappner did it at 90 right so they still help is he still something

[00:19:20] you'd love to do you know uh I when I moved to us and all these opportunities opened for me

[00:19:27] and I truly saw like wow there is just there were opportunities in this country that and

[00:19:34] a Soviet Union I just never had and I realized like whoa you could do a lot on earth like you

[00:19:39] don't have to actually go and sit in the teeny little capsule and pee in a diaper and swallow you

[00:19:44] on toothpaste you know to do cool things um and also we can blow up you know at when you're going

[00:19:51] up in the space shuttle and it's just the risk of it and the toothpaste swallowing and just wasn't

[00:19:57] working for me and I found a lot of exciting things on earth and so I still love that idea

[00:20:04] and I still love the thought of one day you know being able to live in space in the whole star

[00:20:10] track you know concept and it's exciting for most people I think yeah but but I figured I can build

[00:20:18] things here on earth and just and get the just as much excitement absolutely love that and

[00:20:24] I don't want to exaggerate any stereotypes out there but it's someone that that feels more

[00:20:30] extravagant than that traditionally introvert and feel of engineering it feels quite unique

[00:20:36] to your personality here and so refreshing so how was that aspect of your personality

[00:20:42] influence your career path and and also leadership style at null space is this something you get a lot

[00:20:48] to well that's such thoughtful questions that you're asking thank you

[00:20:54] yes I am an extrovert and that's probably why I did not stay in engineering I was a you know

[00:20:59] real research engineer right out of grad school I went to a small startup

[00:21:03] well as a research engineer essentially and realized sitting in front of a computer for eight

[00:21:09] hours a day it's just wasn't working for me and so very quickly I made friends with salespeople

[00:21:15] and the salespeople are like oh this one can talk um let's let's let's grab her and let's start

[00:21:20] talking to her is for a while there we had a VP of engineering who would like make his rounds through

[00:21:25] you know the engineering or sorry VP of sales would make his rounds through the engineering

[00:21:29] department through developers we had a team of I don't know 10 engineers and developers and

[00:21:34] trying to talk to everybody right and the engineers are just getting annoyed because they're

[00:21:37] trying to get their work done and the sales guys are just bothering everybody every day right

[00:21:42] I would talk to him because it was the only one who would talk

[00:21:47] and so I got this role of sort of being the liaison between the engineers because they

[00:21:51] respected me and I respected them and they understood what they were doing

[00:21:55] and then salespeople because I appreciated their extra-worthness

[00:21:59] and then the marketing people because I love the artistic side of marketing

[00:22:03] and so I got this unique role of being able to communicate with all of them and all of them

[00:22:08] coming to me and then me being essentially like a linguist right or translator between the different

[00:22:15] functions and turns out as a really fun role and it got me in front of customers and I loved working

[00:22:20] with customers and so I kind of found my niche to where especially being the CL that extra-version

[00:22:30] definitely really serves me but the ability to like because I went through the through grad school

[00:22:36] I went through the grueling process of getting an engineering degree I understand how hard it is

[00:22:43] I understand engineers I understand what they're trying to do and I don't try and like break them or

[00:22:48] or force things when they set up marketing campaigns or operations I try and respect the engineering

[00:22:56] process as much as I can because they've been there and I get it.

[00:22:59] Love it another thing that attracted me to you guys is no space really stands out amongst so

[00:23:05] many different deep tech companies out there especially with your RF simulation technology being

[00:23:11] significantly faster than incumbent products so I've got to ask though for everyone listening around

[00:23:16] the world what would you say makes no space unique and how do you maintain this engine in such a

[00:23:22] highly competitive market? Yeah so engineering software or engineering simulation tools I should

[00:23:29] say that I was mentioning in the beginning of this podcast have been mostly developed or that

[00:23:35] technology really was kind of like burst out in the scene I should say maybe 40, 30 years ago when

[00:23:41] you started to get real commercial software that could be used as engineering simulation software

[00:23:49] by engineers right and being sold commercially and really essentially in the last 30 years that

[00:23:55] technology has remained unchanged like the solver itself so the solver is what solves your

[00:24:00] governing equations whether it's the electromagnetic governing equations fluid dynamics equations

[00:24:05] mechanical equations and so on so it solves it so that it would simulate it in the computer

[00:24:10] and so that solver or those solvers have remained virtually unchanged even though the companies

[00:24:17] that commercialize them sold them obviously worked quite a bit on the user interface user experience

[00:24:23] as combining multiple solvers together for all kinds of multi-physics simulation technology

[00:24:32] but the solver itself has been pretty much the same for 30 years and so our solvers are more modern

[00:24:37] so they my co-founders have been developing them for about 10 years so 10 years is a long time it

[00:24:45] gives you enough time to validate the solvers against real experimental data but certainly more modern

[00:24:50] than you know the solvers ever developed 30, 40 years ago and they were developed with modern

[00:24:56] computer computing architecture so in order to simulate reality real physical processes

[00:25:05] and the computer that's not like a hyped up video simulation but actually simulate real

[00:25:11] physics in the computer that's hard you have to take solve these really complex governing equations

[00:25:17] convert them into do all kinds of linear algebra manipulations then convert them into complicated

[00:25:25] code then code that into the computer and make sure the architecture of the computer can handle

[00:25:31] these really large simulations so easy and so our solvers are able to take advantage of

[00:25:41] modern computing multiple cores GPU CPU acceleration and go much faster than the codes that were

[00:25:48] developed on you know old school computing architecture and so that's what makes us unique and when I say

[00:25:56] faster you know people like sometimes ask me for not familiar with this process who cares you know

[00:26:02] something takes a second and then something takes a few seconds well engineering simulation usually

[00:26:06] takes very typically hours days sometimes months to do one experiment so imagine you go in like what

[00:26:14] can I compare it to let's say I don't know rendering graphics right rendering graphics sometimes

[00:26:21] take takes a long time but typically not months to render one graphic right engineering simulation could

[00:26:28] typically take very you know hours days and we've talked to engineers that said yes I wait for a

[00:26:36] month to one simulation to finish so when you're dealing with those type of timescales and we could

[00:26:40] slash that down to a day simulation or slash you know something that takes a few weeks to just a few

[00:26:47] hours with the same accuracy and you get the same results and the same data and all of a sudden you

[00:26:53] could do more experiments you could set up optimizations you could run multiple optimizations of whatever

[00:26:59] it is you're trying to optimize right much faster so that's what makes no space unique and special

[00:27:05] in this space and you said much faster I think I'm right saying this I read before you came on

[00:27:10] that your simulation technologies 25 plus times faster so yeah how do you see that how do you

[00:27:17] see that impacting the development cycle of RF technology and and the broader tech industry it feels

[00:27:23] like a real game changes to someone listening outside of this space yeah and I think the answer is

[00:27:30] we'll think about an engineer and engineering process right so an engineer is it's there in design

[00:27:35] technologies that's how we get innovation engineers come up with it and so now all of a sudden

[00:27:42] you know are you telling an engineer an experiment that took you a month were you to sit there and wait

[00:27:47] for the results and then decide decide on how to tweak your design is not going to take you a few

[00:27:52] hours yeah right what can you do with that time and there's a variety of things you could do you

[00:27:58] can either just get your work done faster and deliver the final results faster or you could set up

[00:28:03] more complex simulations more complex experiments and now all of a sudden you're coming up and you're

[00:28:08] with with designs that you could not come up with before you innovate faster you could do things

[00:28:15] like generative design for example so with our software you can plug in an optimizer tool and there's

[00:28:22] you know variety of them out there through Python API you can plug in an optimizer and basically run

[00:28:30] our simulation on sort of an auto loop and design let's say an antenna with a pattern that is

[00:28:36] generative design that a human could not have designed because you just needed to perform to many

[00:28:41] calculations that now is capable of doing things that you know a human designed antenna was not

[00:28:48] able to perform so you can innovate way faster you can come up with stuff you couldn't come up

[00:28:53] with before you can go to market faster you can get your work done faster so there's a whole

[00:28:58] variety of things of how you can use that time as an engineer absolutely love chain with you today

[00:29:05] and looking back at your career obviously you've had such an exciting career that began as a creative

[00:29:11] individual who dislike math to be coming a rocky scientist that's now leading no space for anybody

[00:29:17] listening anywhere in the world that maybe they're inspired by listening to a story like that what

[00:29:22] advice would you offer to an aspiring tech leader especially I would say women and creatives

[00:29:28] looking to make their mark in the tech sector and somehow talk themselves out of it or say that

[00:29:33] they're not technical enough or they're not they don't like math etc what advice would you give

[00:29:38] to that person listening oh yeah that's a pain point so I think for first of all the world needs more

[00:29:43] engineers engineers make a world go round you know they make our lives safe reliable they give us

[00:29:51] opportunities to travel to space to go under the ocean and explore all kinds of depths of you know

[00:29:58] the depths of oceans and just the most far off places in the world were able to explore and understand

[00:30:08] because of engineers right and you know what's interesting is growing up back in Soviet Union so

[00:30:14] obviously there was lots of problems with that country you know I'm very happy to be an American

[00:30:18] I'm very happy to be sure now but one thing that was certainly very different was the culture of

[00:30:26] if you were a girl you were accepted expected you know everyone's equal on suba union right wait

[00:30:32] we know that's not naturally the same but whatever that was the philosophy everyone's equal and

[00:30:36] the good thing that came out of it is as a as a woman you could love fashion you could be extroverted

[00:30:44] you could have a huge group of friends you could like going out you could like

[00:30:51] you know um to take care of your physical appearance let's say and at the same time be really

[00:30:57] good at math and get a PhD and like the two were not mutually exclusive we're here in US unfortunately

[00:31:04] I don't know how the culture has evolved that way but it's seen as mutually exclusive so

[00:31:09] you're seen as if if you're a woman who is going into engineering then you must have zero you know

[00:31:16] tasteful aesthetics you cannot be extroverted you cannot be you know a typical what you would think

[00:31:23] of as a girl and be really good in math and sciences and engineering and that's unfortunate I

[00:31:30] think that culture just needs to change there's no reason for that duality two things could be true

[00:31:35] at the same time you could like colors and and I don't know make up and have a ton of friends

[00:31:43] and still be really good in you know engineering and still have a PhD so I would say two girls out

[00:31:51] there do things that are hard you know do things that other people are not doing and I mean my mom

[00:31:57] cried when I told her I was majoring in engineering she cried she's like why would you kill your

[00:32:03] you know give your to throw your life away like that you could be such a beautiful dancer or an

[00:32:08] artist like why would you destroy your life by becoming an engineer and of course my my mom's

[00:32:16] a doctor my dad the chemist which is funny they should understand that right but I think

[00:32:23] just because you're naturally extroverted and you're good at something doesn't mean that you

[00:32:29] don't force your way through something hard because sometimes that opens doors that would have

[00:32:36] never opened you before and so I would encourage anyone who's listening who is maybe more artistic

[00:32:40] more extroverted not a stereotypical engineer if you have no grit to do things that are hard

[00:32:48] go into engineering because you can with an engineering degree you could do all kinds of other

[00:32:53] things but you will look at the world and you will understand things in a way that without

[00:32:58] that degree you never can I think that's a beautiful and powerful moment to add not but before I

[00:33:05] do want to get one final insight of you because there is such a huge pressure on everybody listening

[00:33:11] at the moment to be in a almost state of continuous learning and also none of us are able to achieve

[00:33:17] any degree of success without a little help along the way so is there a particular person that

[00:33:22] you're grateful towards maybe helps you get you where you are maybe they just saw something and

[00:33:26] you invested a little time in you that we can give a little shout out to the end of this podcast

[00:33:32] and also how do you self educate how do you keep up to speed because the world of engineering

[00:33:38] and technologies is just moving so quickly now isn't it yes moving very fast and it's hard to keep up

[00:33:46] maybe I can combine in the answer to both of your questions and there are certainly many many

[00:33:51] people that have helped me to learn and get to where I am throughout my career and throughout my

[00:33:57] life I can't even begin to name them all but maybe I can name kind of give a shout out to a program

[00:34:03] that I'm part of right now that's helping me learn and grow so I do feel like I'm drinking from

[00:34:08] a fire hose at the moment we are a part so in all spaces a part of an accelerator called creative

[00:34:14] destruction lab or CDL accelerator it is throughout the world and they have multiple

[00:34:20] cohorts cohorts or streams they call them so we're part of the manufacturing cohort

[00:34:24] it's a really interesting program they don't take equity they don't pay the money thing you

[00:34:28] have to be invited and accepted into the accelerator as a startup and then you go through eight

[00:34:35] months off pretty grueling coaching process with really amazing mentors so I want to give

[00:34:42] a shout out to two CDL accelerator for to our manufacturing stream and to our mentors that are

[00:34:50] working with me every day they're spending way more time that they should and these are people

[00:34:54] who are getting paid thousands of dollars to consult with private equity firms and VC firms

[00:34:58] their own investors themselves their operators of companies and they're giving and donating their

[00:35:05] time to coach me on how to fundraise on how to build a company on how to essentially grow up

[00:35:13] into being a professional CEO it is very hard because you're I mean I'm constantly learning things

[00:35:19] that are so new and I'm not a spring chicken anymore so it's like you know it didn't really stretch

[00:35:25] as your ring capacity but they have been just so amazing and supportive and I've learned so much

[00:35:34] from them so I'd like I'd love to that's that's one of the ways I learned yeah kind of hands-on

[00:35:39] and experimenting and CDL accelerator allows me to do that well a big shout out to all CDL accelerator

[00:35:47] after everything that they're doing it and for yourself anybody listening wanting to find out

[00:35:51] more information about you your team all the work that you're working on at the moment or maybe

[00:35:57] just reach out and connect with you or find out more information where would you like to send

[00:36:01] everyone listening for sure so to connect with me I'm happy to connect on LinkedIn it's

[00:36:07] Masha V Petrova on LinkedIn and then our website is nolspaceink.com if you'd like to find out more

[00:36:15] about Nolspace or if you're in our F engineer listening open to new technologies reach out tell us

[00:36:22] we happy to schedule a demo well as we approach nearly 3000 interviews this is one of those

[00:36:29] episodes that will stick with me long after we finish recording because it's one of those interviews

[00:36:35] that had absolutely everything for me almost like a Netflix series from a creative who hates maths

[00:36:40] to becoming a rocket scientist talking about why engineering simulation is so crucial to our tech

[00:36:46] future and our world growing radio frequency demand in everything from agriculture to space

[00:36:52] and that big shout out to CDL accelerator but more than just thank you for taking that time to sit

[00:36:57] down with me today and share that story thank you so much thank you for such a deep questions Neil

[00:37:03] then great I think it's clear that the landscape of engineering and technological innovation is

[00:37:09] as much about resilience and vision of those who dare to explore it as it is about the technical

[00:37:16] challenges that they solve and I think Masha's journey from a creative young girl with a dream of

[00:37:21] space exploration to becoming the helm of Nolspace accompanied at the forefront of addressing

[00:37:27] the critical shortage of electromagnetic engineers I think it's testament to the power of

[00:37:33] perseverance diversity thinking outside the box and this story not only demystifies the complex world

[00:37:40] of RF technology and engineering simulation but for me it serves as a beacon of inspiration for

[00:37:47] aspiring engineers that could be listening to this anywhere in the world regardless of your

[00:37:53] background or personal inclinations I think Masha's narrative underscores a powerful message

[00:37:59] innovation knows no boundaries so I sincerely hope that today's episode

[00:38:05] has sparked your curiosity and encouraged you to look beyond the surface of technology and appreciate

[00:38:11] the diverse tapestry of people and the stories that make it all possible but what part of her journey

[00:38:18] resonated most with you how do you see technology and innovation evolving in the coming years

[00:38:23] and what role or what role do you see diversity of thought and different backgrounds playing in

[00:38:29] shaping that future this is where I put the microphone in front of you please show with me your

[00:38:34] thoughts join the conversation email me tech blog writer outrook.com twitter linked in instagram

[00:38:39] just at neo cqs and please keep pushing the boundaries of what's possible and also why not join me

[00:38:47] again tomorrow for another conversation just lightly so thank you for listening as always and until

[00:38:52] next time don't be a stranger