3033: ACI Worldwide: Battling Fraud in the Era of Instant Payments

[00:00:03] [SPEAKER_01]: How can financial institutions stay ahead of the ever-evolving landscape of fraud?

[00:00:10] [SPEAKER_01]: In a world where real-time payments are the norm.

[00:00:14] [SPEAKER_01]: Well today we're joined by Cleber Martins, Head of Payments and Intelligence and Risk Solutions

[00:00:19] [SPEAKER_01]: at a company called ACI Worldwide, and with the rise of real-time payment schemes,

[00:00:26] [SPEAKER_01]: the financial industry currently faces new challenges in fraud prevention.

[00:00:31] [SPEAKER_01]: And legacy systems that once allowed days to detect fraud are no longer sufficient in an

[00:00:36] [SPEAKER_01]: era where transactions are now completed in seconds, and that shift has created a critical

[00:00:42] [SPEAKER_01]: need for advanced methods that will keep pace with the speed of instant payments.

[00:00:47] [SPEAKER_01]: So in this episode today we're going to talk about the complexities of real-time

[00:00:52] [SPEAKER_01]: fraud detection, the crucial role AI, Mike play in both combating and facility in fraud.

[00:00:59] [SPEAKER_01]: And also discuss how financial institutions are levity AI to track and predict behaviour

[00:01:05] [SPEAKER_01]: by metrics, and how criminals are using the same technology to carry out sophisticated

[00:01:10] [SPEAKER_01]: social engineering scams. So we'll learn about the challenges that banks face in implementing AI

[00:01:16] [SPEAKER_01]: solutions including the cost and expertise required, and why a collaborative approach between

[00:01:21] [SPEAKER_01]: institutions is crucial for making real-time payments one of the safest methods available.

[00:01:28] [SPEAKER_01]: So whether you are in the financial sector or simply interested in the intersection of technology

[00:01:33] [SPEAKER_01]: and security, this conversation hopefully will offer you some valuable perspectives on the future

[00:01:39] [SPEAKER_01]: of fraud protection. Before we get today's guest on I want to talk about the fact that defense

[00:01:43] [SPEAKER_01]: contractors face immense pressure to comply with something called CMMC2.0 security standard,

[00:01:50] [SPEAKER_01]: and finding a secure, easy-to-use file sharing solution meeting those guidelines can be a major

[00:01:56] [SPEAKER_01]: challenge. The federal government and federal systems integrators supporting the Department of

[00:02:01] [SPEAKER_01]: Defense have similar compliance requirements for improving cybersecurity and data protection too.

[00:02:07] [SPEAKER_01]: So if you are an IT admin in the defense sector, if you are tired of juggling complex

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[00:03:02] [SPEAKER_01]: But now is time to return to our regularly scheduled programming and welcome today's guest on

[00:03:08] [SPEAKER_01]: to the mic. Let's get to the next guest off!

[00:03:11] [SPEAKER_01]: So a massive welcome to the show. Can you tell everyone this thing a little about who you are

[00:03:17] [SPEAKER_00]: and what you do? Well, my name is Kleber Martin's. The head of Femons in

[00:03:21] [SPEAKER_00]: thousands and risk solutions for ECA weren't waned. So my role is to be about bringing

[00:03:28] [SPEAKER_00]: thousands of payments especially in order to protect Femons weren't way.

[00:03:33] [SPEAKER_01]: And that's one of the big reasons I invited you on the podcast today. I really want

[00:03:37] [SPEAKER_01]: to focus on the world of real-time payments. They are increasing now. There's a lot of

[00:03:42] [SPEAKER_01]: activity in this space. So why does fraud detection and prevention

[00:03:48] [SPEAKER_01]: in what ways are becoming more challenging now? What are you saying?

[00:03:53] [SPEAKER_00]: Well, so AC Award White is the leading off-the-real-time image work.

[00:03:57] [SPEAKER_00]: So I think the first thing we see is the growth. Real-time payments is really something

[00:04:03] [SPEAKER_00]: important for the economy. It's cheaper for consumers. It's good for the countries to have more

[00:04:10] [SPEAKER_00]: of their money actually at the economy. So everybody's pushing for that.

[00:04:17] [SPEAKER_00]: The first challenge that comes with real-time payments is the whole concept of being real-time.

[00:04:23] [SPEAKER_00]: Right? So once something is real-time, it's done. So your ability to stop it, your ability

[00:04:27] [SPEAKER_00]: to revert it, it has to be minimized because otherwise you would have been a reliable payment method.

[00:04:34] [SPEAKER_00]: So because it's real-time, everything you need to do to prevent has to be done in

[00:04:40] [SPEAKER_00]: why it has to be done as the transaction is happening. Right? So if you think about the benefit

[00:04:47] [SPEAKER_00]: from the consumer perspective, it's huge. Consumers have better ways to pay. They will be able

[00:04:52] [SPEAKER_00]: to experience better, you know, buy better by easier and by cheaper. But at the same time,

[00:04:59] [SPEAKER_00]: the criminals will also leverage this. So the criminals will actually go after that opportunity

[00:05:05] [SPEAKER_00]: to see the money on their hands quicker, right? And criminals are about to get their hands on the money.

[00:05:11] [SPEAKER_00]: So if you think about what they've been doing over the last few years, they've been exploring a lot

[00:05:16] [SPEAKER_00]: of the commerce fraud. The e-commerce fraud, they really need to buy a product, go sell the black

[00:05:20] [SPEAKER_00]: market, they lose something, it takes a while. Real-time payments just over that for the,

[00:05:25] [SPEAKER_00]: criminals as well. So real-time payments mean money, other than in real time.

[00:05:31] [SPEAKER_01]: And I'm curious, can they existing for prevention solutions? Keep up with the demands of real

[00:05:36] [SPEAKER_01]: target payments and if that car will kind of risk to this post both to banks and consumers?

[00:05:43] [SPEAKER_00]: Well, so everybody has a fraud prevention solution to date, right? So fraud starts something new

[00:05:49] [SPEAKER_00]: instead of whatever. Now the fraud prevention solutions that are out there, they have really,

[00:05:55] [SPEAKER_00]: you know, folks on the, authenticating the user. So who is the person initiating at transaction?

[00:06:03] [SPEAKER_00]: So there's a lot of capabilities out there that the financial institutions use to make sure that

[00:06:10] [SPEAKER_00]: it is clever accessing clever as account, right? So account they go over can be avoided. There's a lot

[00:06:15] [SPEAKER_00]: of tactics using in terms of the device that I'm using to access my account. It's very effective.

[00:06:22] [SPEAKER_00]: There is also, we see a lot of biometrics, right? Face recognition, gelog gains,

[00:06:27] [SPEAKER_00]: second-factor authentication. So all those tactics, they're actually good for pro-pro-pro-viction.

[00:06:34] [SPEAKER_00]: So getting someone to initiate a real-time payments on my accounts, I'm announcing,

[00:06:38] [SPEAKER_00]: initiating their real-time payments. It's to a challenge, right? You're in those two trying to get

[00:06:42] [SPEAKER_00]: access to your account to do that. But what's really challenging at this point is that criminals

[00:06:49] [SPEAKER_00]: are convincing people to initiate the transactions. So they're consumer, they're, they're only

[00:06:55] [SPEAKER_00]: account-out there is the one who actually initiates the transaction, believing they should be doing

[00:07:00] [SPEAKER_00]: that transaction, right? And that's where social engineering comes. So we hear a lot about the

[00:07:09] [SPEAKER_00]: P-FROD. And that's really about the consumer being, the criminal using social engineering

[00:07:16] [SPEAKER_00]: to get the consumer to initiate the transaction. Once the consumer initiated the transaction,

[00:07:21] [SPEAKER_00]: think we've made, they bypass all the controls that were building there. So the biggest challenge

[00:07:26] [SPEAKER_00]: really for banks and consumers is to deal with this new-way cream knows our approaching,

[00:07:32] [SPEAKER_00]: getting access to the funds, getting access to the money. And that's really to, you know,

[00:07:37] [SPEAKER_00]: the consumer initiated transaction. When you think about the capabilities that we haven't

[00:07:42] [SPEAKER_00]: placed today for a account-tick-over, for validating the user identity, that technology is too,

[00:07:49] [SPEAKER_00]: you know, very effective, also, Chanderson Behember. We have our tuition intelligence being used there

[00:07:57] [SPEAKER_00]: to make sure, you know, clever logs in from that computer, logging out this time of the day.

[00:08:01] [SPEAKER_00]: It's really his behavior. Now, this signals that you get from those capabilities, the AI signals,

[00:08:10] [SPEAKER_00]: they need to be explored different. Right? So the challenge for definition institutions is how

[00:08:15] [SPEAKER_00]: to leverage, you know, even the AI capabilities they have to then make it work better for,

[00:08:21] [SPEAKER_00]: you know, the new ways of criminal activity. On the other hand, they really important thing

[00:08:27] [SPEAKER_00]: then becomes, where's that money going? Because, you know, if the criminal has access to an account

[00:08:35] [SPEAKER_00]: that's there just waiting for criminal money to come in. And nobody's watching it, they will make

[00:08:41] [SPEAKER_00]: their life even easier. Right? So if you think about fraud, before real-time payments or before

[00:08:47] [SPEAKER_00]: this camps and they could be fraud, it was all about making sure the money doesn't get out. Now,

[00:08:53] [SPEAKER_00]: those, you know, definitions, institutions got to also look for the money coming in as one of the key

[00:09:01] [SPEAKER_00]: challenge to mitigate the type of of, of a problem. I'm like, with some of your perspective,

[00:09:06] [SPEAKER_01]: the risk is being victim of this camp, right? It really is. And as this is a tech podcast,

[00:09:12] [SPEAKER_01]: it was only a matter of time before I mentioned the word, AI or artificial intelligence. And

[00:09:17] [SPEAKER_01]: the reason I got to bring it up here is because fraudsters are increasingly using AI tools to

[00:09:22] [SPEAKER_01]: exploit further vulnerability. So I don't know any emerging AI techniques that they're employing

[00:09:28] [SPEAKER_01]: that you're seeing because it's all right and hard, they space our perspectives,

[00:09:32] [SPEAKER_00]: something you're watching very closely unfold. There is certainly, right? If you think about

[00:09:38] [SPEAKER_00]: AI capabilities, they help a lot with social engineer. Right? AI can very quickly understand

[00:09:45] [SPEAKER_00]: human behavior or AI can simply human behavior. It's, you know, criminals get AI to pretend to be,

[00:09:51] [SPEAKER_00]: let's say, your father, Columbia. And they could, you know, mimic the voice of your father,

[00:09:57] [SPEAKER_00]: right? Which makes it very easy for you to believe actually from, you know, if you think about

[00:10:04] [SPEAKER_00]: financial institutions, they struggle to get the budget and the projects and, you know,

[00:10:09] [SPEAKER_00]: to get to exercise those new AI capabilities and explore the benefit of the future,

[00:10:14] [SPEAKER_00]: to the proper venture. On the criminal side, the budget is not that limited, right? They have a

[00:10:21] [SPEAKER_00]: lot of money, they don't have bureaucracy, they can just go and start exploring those things.

[00:10:27] [SPEAKER_00]: And for an associated nearing perspective on the tactics inside of social engineering, there's

[00:10:32] [SPEAKER_00]: one thing called, in heated trust, meaning that, you know, if you hear a voice that you recognize

[00:10:40] [SPEAKER_00]: your father's voice, right? Ask each month, send money or send voice, ask each send money.

[00:10:45] [SPEAKER_00]: You can hit at that trust, right? And social engineering is leveraging this and there's AI

[00:10:51] [SPEAKER_00]: capabilities out there that criminals are using. I really feel like they're creating that

[00:10:57] [SPEAKER_00]: heated trust so that, you know, the consumers are believing they should be doomed or thanks in

[00:11:02] [SPEAKER_01]: the earliest shit, whether or not. And a question I've got to ask here because there's a lot of

[00:11:07] [SPEAKER_01]: hyper-ad AI, so if we look beyond that hype, is it really effective for finance to insist institutions,

[00:11:13] [SPEAKER_01]: leveraging AI to track things like behavioral biometrics as an ultimate defense against some

[00:11:20] [SPEAKER_00]: of these advanced fraud tactics that we're seeing? Well, it wasn't more effective when the problem

[00:11:26] [SPEAKER_00]: was really about logging into your account and not being new rate. It's less effective now,

[00:11:32] [SPEAKER_00]: to be fair, you know, if you think about the whole scheme where the consumer and the

[00:11:37] [SPEAKER_00]: system's action, you really need to cross-bumblers. You need to leverage a IK to build us that

[00:11:43] [SPEAKER_00]: are still not leverage today as an example, right? Fedorate the mission learned. This is an AI technique

[00:11:50] [SPEAKER_00]: where the learning goals were the data as in its distributed, meaning that, you know, the bank

[00:11:57] [SPEAKER_00]: that is initiating the transaction, the bank that's receiving the transaction, they should

[00:12:02] [SPEAKER_00]: learn it together, right? As a Fedorate as a Fedorated capability, other than trying to learn

[00:12:09] [SPEAKER_00]: individually only with the signals they have on their end. Right? So the technology has to evolve.

[00:12:16] [SPEAKER_00]: It's natural with being, you know, embracing new technology all the time. I think we're just seeing

[00:12:21] [SPEAKER_00]: an accelerated path that, you know, the latest on AI capabilities had to be embraced faster by the financial

[00:12:30] [SPEAKER_01]: industry. So in the context of real-time payments, what role do you see AI playing in and

[00:12:37] [SPEAKER_01]: hampsing real-time to a point where it is safer than other payment methods? What are you seeing here?

[00:12:45] [SPEAKER_00]: Well, I go to tell you, real-time payments will be the safest payment method ever,

[00:12:50] [SPEAKER_00]: having rain in. If you think about the real-time payments that technology find that the

[00:13:00] [SPEAKER_00]: end technological bear to anything in the past. So they're capable of caring much more data,

[00:13:10] [SPEAKER_00]: and, you know, by data, let's go further to AI in, you know, start seeing disaster signals, right?

[00:13:17] [SPEAKER_00]: So what are signals? Signals are AI interpretations or intelligence that can flow with the

[00:13:24] [SPEAKER_00]: transaction itself. So remember, I told you that the bank initiating the payment and the bank

[00:13:29] [SPEAKER_00]: receiving the payment have to go over eight. You know, kind of payments rails. They're in our

[00:13:34] [SPEAKER_00]: list. The technology called ISO-2002, which is this new, you know, technology behind those rails

[00:13:42] [SPEAKER_00]: and it's really data-centric. So those two buttons can actually collaborate in exchanging

[00:13:49] [SPEAKER_00]: intelligence, a idle-inwards inside of the message itself without even relying on the regular

[00:13:56] [SPEAKER_00]: to go, define what they need to do. Right? So the rails are so strong from a data intelligence

[00:14:02] [SPEAKER_00]: perspective that at the moment that the financial institutions have started embracing the

[00:14:07] [SPEAKER_00]: concept that they work together against, you know, the type of criminal activity and they embrace

[00:14:13] [SPEAKER_00]: that technology deliver what, you know, this new AI capabilities can deliver that collaborative approach.

[00:14:20] [SPEAKER_00]: They will definitely make real-time payments the safest payment method.

[00:14:27] [SPEAKER_01]: And you mentioned signals there, so I gain a quiz. How can financial institutions use these

[00:14:33] [SPEAKER_01]: anti-fraud signals not just to prevent fraud, but also develop and improve financial products and services?

[00:14:39] [SPEAKER_00]: Is this possible, too? Well, it's a great question. So a signal is actually an expression

[00:14:46] [SPEAKER_00]: of intelligence correlation between a human intelligence or human has an intelligent,

[00:14:52] [SPEAKER_00]: having no that something shouldn't happen this way or on their way, right? There's human intelligence.

[00:14:57] [SPEAKER_00]: There's the data intelligence data tells you what's going well, what's going bad.

[00:15:03] [SPEAKER_00]: And there's the AI intelligence with the ability to actually correlate all those

[00:15:07] [SPEAKER_00]: of data points and history in everything you know. When you correlate those things together,

[00:15:13] [SPEAKER_00]: you end up with an expression of an insight, right? A predictable intelligence, which you can

[00:15:21] [SPEAKER_00]: actually just write it down as a signal. A signal becomes then on AI language that any machine

[00:15:30] [SPEAKER_00]: learning anywhere can actually leverage to make more precise decisions. So when we think about

[00:15:37] [SPEAKER_00]: a signal could be that this is a new account just was just set up. I don't really trust the

[00:15:44] [SPEAKER_00]: identity, it could be a fake identity or an stolen identity. So it becomes a signal.

[00:15:52] [SPEAKER_00]: That's seeking a damn and definitely be used for fraud prevention, right? It just expressed

[00:15:56] [SPEAKER_00]: there's something bad there. But if you think about if you go further after fraud prevention,

[00:16:01] [SPEAKER_00]: I still need to do a bunch of money on for it. Right? I can leverage that signal. That information

[00:16:09] [SPEAKER_00]: that there's account was set up at something risky can actually help a bunch of money

[00:16:14] [SPEAKER_00]: boundary controls to be more effective, right? You can also think about signals that the

[00:16:20] [SPEAKER_00]: initiation end off the transaction. So when I consumers enter as a scam and I criminals

[00:16:25] [SPEAKER_00]: convincing you a transaction, he will express some urge. Right? So AI is capable of capturing

[00:16:33] [SPEAKER_00]: that ankle work that just signal. So the customer's feeling better to the customer's feeling

[00:16:41] [SPEAKER_00]: not confident on initiating those transactions. Those signals that you're using for fraud prevention

[00:16:46] [SPEAKER_00]: can later be used as well or can even earlier be used as well to provide the consumer with a better

[00:16:53] [SPEAKER_00]: customer that is in a merge. They have a different need probably that is not when even

[00:16:59] [SPEAKER_00]: when they're doing a good transaction, it's really a little transaction there. Right? So that's

[00:17:04] [SPEAKER_00]: seeking out damn becomes a library of intelligence that you're just collecting and leveraging

[00:17:09] [SPEAKER_00]: this from AI perspective to deliver better services. So the whole concept of converting

[00:17:16] [SPEAKER_00]: the correlation of intelligence between human data and AI into signals goes away beyond

[00:17:22] [SPEAKER_00]: through our prevention. And you know that's a good point. We mentioned earlier, right? The real

[00:17:27] [SPEAKER_00]: time things will be the safest payments but it will also be the way to provide consumers with the

[00:17:33] [SPEAKER_00]: best experiences out there because you can actually leverage this to really get your point that we

[00:17:40] [SPEAKER_00]: call a hyper personalization. Right? You can really personalize for mean individually for you and

[00:17:45] [SPEAKER_00]: you need to have a better time in need. That's the value for where you're worrying their life.

[00:17:53] [SPEAKER_01]: And I suspect that you've got the air of a lot of different businesses and business leaders

[00:17:57] [SPEAKER_01]: and a lot of people in this space all around the world and from all those conversations that you're

[00:18:02] [SPEAKER_01]: having, what are the biggest challenges that banks are facing when integrating AI driven solutions

[00:18:07] [SPEAKER_01]: and any tips or advice on how they can overcome those obstacles that you keep hearing about?

[00:18:14] [SPEAKER_00]: Well, we've been one earlier, right? The costs and the whole challenge with budget. You

[00:18:19] [SPEAKER_00]: got budget. I think if you think about those projects, the two implement AI you really need to

[00:18:25] [SPEAKER_00]: have the right skills in place. Okay? So today it is a complex technology space,

[00:18:30] [SPEAKER_00]: don't data so you need to collect your data, put your data in somewhere, deal with data privacy,

[00:18:36] [SPEAKER_00]: data rest in constraints. Right? So all of this has a lot of cost. And the way it's then today,

[00:18:43] [SPEAKER_00]: cost in terms of energy, as well, right? A lot of people who roll with a lot of data. But you know,

[00:18:49] [SPEAKER_00]: all that you're doing there is a project. So it's far somewhere you have an objective and

[00:18:55] [SPEAKER_00]: you start dealing with all those challenge. The next challenge then becomes dominolejects

[00:19:01] [SPEAKER_00]: for you because you know, your trench and chief on objective, which could be for our prevention,

[00:19:06] [SPEAKER_00]: could be doing a better marketing campaign using AI. And you're leveraging, you know,

[00:19:13] [SPEAKER_00]: history usually to predict what is the best outcome with AI? So I can help you maximize your results.

[00:19:22] [SPEAKER_00]: I think the biggest challenge then becomes how do you make it work for the present, not for the

[00:19:28] [SPEAKER_00]: past. Right? So if you think about you as a consumer when you were, you know, making your payments,

[00:19:34] [SPEAKER_00]: you're expressing something that's happening in your life. The thing that today is the main

[00:19:40] [SPEAKER_00]: relationship that you have with your financial institution, right? You don't walk into brands anymore.

[00:19:45] [SPEAKER_00]: You're not on the website, check in your balance all the time. It's very easy for you to

[00:19:48] [SPEAKER_00]: Jeff, you know, access. But you're paying all the time. Right? So the relationship that

[00:19:54] [SPEAKER_00]: payment becomes the most frequent connection that you have with the financial institution.

[00:20:00] [SPEAKER_00]: So the challenge that really becomes for the AI capabilities to leverage this at the present,

[00:20:08] [SPEAKER_00]: not from the past. So what's happening now has to help me as the consumer in the financial

[00:20:15] [SPEAKER_00]: institution, as the services provider, right? The financial services provider should chief a better

[00:20:21] [SPEAKER_00]: outcome for both of us. If it's not considering what I'm doing now, it's really not as relevant

[00:20:28] [SPEAKER_00]: for me as a consumer. So Joel, we're kind of those obstacles. I think the real challenge then

[00:20:35] [SPEAKER_00]: becomes, you know, how do you grace a technology that will actually really create that

[00:20:42] [SPEAKER_00]: think about that as the pipes or AI? Right? Or think about it, it tricitizes a great analogy. So

[00:20:50] [SPEAKER_00]: you can go anywhere in your house, plug any of the device that someone built for you and the

[00:20:55] [SPEAKER_00]: outlet and you know what you expect. Right? And the same happens at the factory, they be put

[00:21:01] [SPEAKER_00]: that device out with expectations on what happens when you plug on the power outlet. And AI

[00:21:07] [SPEAKER_00]: has to come the same thing, has to become the same thing. All those signals that I'm talking about,

[00:21:13] [SPEAKER_00]: all that technology that converts the domain knowledge across in your organization into signals

[00:21:18] [SPEAKER_00]: has to be available just as electricity for the rest of their organization. Right? And for the

[00:21:24] [SPEAKER_00]: seasons that you need to make in real time. So I think that's the challenge. The challenge is

[00:21:29] [SPEAKER_00]: to make AI stop being a project and really become something that's everywhere within the

[00:21:35] [SPEAKER_00]: organization and organize distributed at the same time accessible as if it was centralized by any

[00:21:42] [SPEAKER_00]: one that plugs on that AI outlet. And then you get AI to really work with the on day-to-day

[00:21:49] [SPEAKER_00]: base or you know but deep hyper personal life experience or. And if we were to look ahead into

[00:21:58] [SPEAKER_01]: the future, how do you see the landscape of fraud prevention workforce as evolving with the

[00:22:04] [SPEAKER_01]: continuous advancement of AI technologies? Because we hear a lot about the technology, but extra workforce

[00:22:10] [SPEAKER_01]: and the people and how they're working alongside AI. That's where the cost of happens right?

[00:22:15] [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, that is. And if you think about that in a lot of people fear that AI will

[00:22:18] [SPEAKER_00]: their jobs or answer you say, I was really good to be for a provincial way, they need for a

[00:22:22] [SPEAKER_00]: provincial team. Right? And we'll never be. And that wasn't my point earlier about the

[00:22:28] [SPEAKER_00]: main knowledge expert. The AI really relied on data. It also relies on human intelligence to

[00:22:36] [SPEAKER_00]: you know pointing in the right direction, making sure that you're doing the right, you have the right

[00:22:40] [SPEAKER_00]: context in your achieving the expected results and so on. So I think looking forward not maybe

[00:22:48] [SPEAKER_00]: only throughout prevention, I think for our prevention my best step to have. But looking forward

[00:22:54] [SPEAKER_00]: AI really has to become part of our day-to-day ones. So we see for example

[00:23:00] [SPEAKER_00]: chat to eat eating, dip, we use it right? So everybody now goes to a compiler chat to eat and they

[00:23:06] [SPEAKER_00]: have the experience of using largely English based models to you know enhance their messaging or

[00:23:12] [SPEAKER_00]: right better emails or write an article right? In the future everything you do in your job

[00:23:20] [SPEAKER_00]: will leverage AI capabilities because they will be there just like with the screen.

[00:23:26] [SPEAKER_00]: So if I am a marketing person in a financial institution and I want to start a new marketing

[00:23:33] [SPEAKER_00]: campaign and I'm glad to this you know AI signals outlet right? I can leverage everything that

[00:23:41] [SPEAKER_00]: you know people have done on the proper mentioned side, on the instrument of our website, on the

[00:23:45] [SPEAKER_00]: because you know the credit risk assessment side and I don't even need to go learn what their

[00:23:52] [SPEAKER_00]: domain knowledge is but the signals are there and AI will help me to build better campaigns and

[00:23:58] [SPEAKER_00]: achieve better results because they can leverage this. So I think the work you know the work in the

[00:24:09] [SPEAKER_00]: background, your domain space but really leveraging AI for that so you can really focus on what

[00:24:15] [SPEAKER_00]: you're trying to achieve as a business and be more effective on what you do. For our prevention

[00:24:20] [SPEAKER_00]: is just you know similar for our prevention is becoming very much like that. So we have

[00:24:28] [SPEAKER_00]: libraries with signals available. We hear about scores, we hear about intelligence, you know devices,

[00:24:35] [SPEAKER_00]: network, mobile network and intelligence, emailing, intelligence, off those are signals.

[00:24:41] [SPEAKER_00]: But those signals today they're super different from each other right? So the challenge with

[00:24:46] [SPEAKER_00]: the new technologies really to make it in a way that it's standard guys so you don't need

[00:24:52] [SPEAKER_00]: really need to go to a project you just plug a new signal and guess what AI will figure out the best

[00:24:57] [SPEAKER_00]: which leverage it for the work. So you know for our prevention work course we'll be way more about

[00:25:04] [SPEAKER_00]: looking at the right signals, making bigger decisions, being more effective, more precise.

[00:25:10] [SPEAKER_01]: And on the same subject of people I think everyone feels a certain amount of pressure

[00:25:15] [SPEAKER_01]: being in a state of continuous learning or an expectation to be in continuous learning and it

[00:25:21] [SPEAKER_01]: can be difficult keeping up to speed with the pace of technological change. So I've got to ask

[00:25:26] [SPEAKER_01]: where or how do you self educate any tips or if you can share that too? Well so this is

[00:25:33] [SPEAKER_00]: a very interesting question so we were just working with a university as part of the

[00:25:39] [SPEAKER_00]: core program to go, you know, younger, calendar, organization. And as we talk to that specific

[00:25:46] [SPEAKER_00]: universe they say hey you really need to get this people excited about the continuous learning

[00:25:51] [SPEAKER_00]: and our organization so they will prefer to work for you. I'm like well that's cool but they come

[00:25:56] [SPEAKER_00]: with a lot of things they're learning right? And they need to say yes but what they're learning

[00:26:01] [SPEAKER_00]: today will be a good for a year and then they will feel that they are outdated right? So

[00:26:07] [SPEAKER_00]: in that challenge happens to all of us I think you know the technology itself is our challenge

[00:26:12] [SPEAKER_00]: today we want you to stay up to date with the technology but I truly believe that the technology

[00:26:19] [SPEAKER_00]: will not necessarily be as the main deal you run on me to learn your technology. This whole

[00:26:24] [SPEAKER_00]: year that you need to learn coding, you need to learn specific technology and get up to speed

[00:26:29] [SPEAKER_00]: I'm not convinced this is the bad. I think the future will be about self-inducating or learning

[00:26:37] [SPEAKER_00]: about business for your it's understanding really what the consumer demand is right? You know measuring

[00:26:45] [SPEAKER_00]: short-term impact other than long-term, kind of investment for example for any real

[00:26:51] [SPEAKER_00]: that you are. So what I'm doing myself to you know stay up to speed is really focusing on that so

[00:26:58] [SPEAKER_00]: people train she offers solutions before in their thinging problem statements and really about

[00:27:04] [SPEAKER_00]: understanding problem statements. So if I get to learn I want to learn something specific,

[00:27:10] [SPEAKER_00]: I'll go learn what is the real problem statement behind as many ideas of solution that people usually

[00:27:16] [SPEAKER_00]: are cheaply and the first to do it is all around that's it's difficult to do the right research

[00:27:23] [SPEAKER_00]: something you need to go in there till but I've been using I'm actually personal using Copilot a lot

[00:27:29] [SPEAKER_00]: right and sometimes I'm driving and I'm speaking with Copilot about a specific topic and driving

[00:27:35] [SPEAKER_00]: it to write to build the right research and coming back with the answer so I'm having

[00:27:40] [SPEAKER_00]: interactive learning conversations with Copilot when I'm driving as a way to stay up to speed on

[00:27:46] [SPEAKER_00]: what I'm trying to achieve from my career perspective. Love that so many good advice

[00:27:53] [SPEAKER_01]: though I have to try so with that myself and for anyone that we did cover a lot of content

[00:28:00] [SPEAKER_01]: and a short amount of time there so for anyone listening what's the best place for them to find

[00:28:05] [SPEAKER_01]: you online your team online or we'll just take a little bit deeper on anything we talked about

[00:28:10] [SPEAKER_00]: today in your work of course. There's a lot of the information we've been sharing with podcasts

[00:28:16] [SPEAKER_00]: like this one or webinars that we run our website that they say worldwide are constant for

[00:28:22] [SPEAKER_00]: you know grading information about what we're doing there's a lot of initiative in this

[00:28:27] [SPEAKER_00]: through widening initiatives we're running with industry peers or you know aggregators

[00:28:32] [SPEAKER_00]: with DLA side deals with a lot of centering for instructors they're great you know from

[00:28:37] [SPEAKER_00]: multiple type of intelligence sharing and we're really taking an open approach we're really exposing

[00:28:43] [SPEAKER_00]: why we want to achieve the world where collaboration is driving you know the future for a better

[00:28:50] [SPEAKER_00]: especially when real time payments how do you get real time things really to be the safest

[00:28:55] [SPEAKER_00]: or you know payment method ever so what we're going to say is tool of information there's a lot

[00:29:00] [SPEAKER_00]: out there when you are interested on the topic it's just making sure that you go for you know

[00:29:08] [SPEAKER_00]: learning about the future not learning about the many ideas on how solutions could be

[00:29:13] [SPEAKER_00]: it's really about you know what's the problem statement and how you felt some that should

[00:29:18] [SPEAKER_01]: long term in there well so my little things to everything to make it easy for everyone to find

[00:29:25] [SPEAKER_01]: you and get in touch too and as I said we come to a lot there from knowing emerging AI tools

[00:29:30] [SPEAKER_01]: that fraudsters are using right now how financial institutions are firing fire with fire by using

[00:29:37] [SPEAKER_01]: AI to track and predict behavioural biometrics and also sharing how different ways that financial

[00:29:45] [SPEAKER_01]: institutions can help make the industry safer by using antifraud data to build an improved financial

[00:29:51] [SPEAKER_01]: products and services and look if there is anybody from the industry listing I'd love to hear

[00:29:56] [SPEAKER_01]: their feedback on our conversation today but more than it does thank you for sharing your story

[00:30:01] [SPEAKER_01]: today thank you you're well pleasure thank you so what steps can find natural institutions take

[00:30:07] [SPEAKER_01]: to fortify their defenses against this new breed of fraud that is emerging in an age of real time

[00:30:14] [SPEAKER_01]: payments as my guest highlighted today the integration of AI into fraud prevention is not just an option

[00:30:21] [SPEAKER_01]: it is an assessed in our and while the instant nature of real time payments introduce a significant

[00:30:27] [SPEAKER_01]: challenges AI is providing powerful tools for monitoring transactions and predicting fraudulent behaviour

[00:30:35] [SPEAKER_01]: but as we've learned criminals are adapting they're using AI to enhance their own tactics too

[00:30:41] [SPEAKER_01]: which means this ongoing cat and mouse game to stay ahead is ongoing and intense but reflecting on

[00:30:49] [SPEAKER_01]: today's discussion I think it's clear that the future of fraud protection will require a collaborative

[00:30:54] [SPEAKER_01]: effort among financial institutions leveraging AI to create a safer and more secure environment for all

[00:31:02] [SPEAKER_01]: so I'd love to hear your thoughts on this let me know email me tech blog writer at rook.com twitter

[00:31:07] [SPEAKER_01]: link to an Instagram at neocyhios but until our next episode consider this how will your

[00:31:13] [SPEAKER_01]: institution harness AI not to only protect against fraud but also turn these insights into a strategic

[00:31:20] [SPEAKER_01]: advantage that is your homework I mean a guardaway and think about that and I'll be back to discuss

[00:31:25] [SPEAKER_01]: another topic tomorrow so I'll speak with you all there