3136: Tech and Infection Control: Insights from Dr. Deborah Birx and Amy Carenza

[00:00:04] How can advanced technology transform infection control in healthcare and beyond?

[00:00:11] Well today I'm very fortunate I'm going to be joined by Dr. Deborah Birx, Chief Medical and Science Advisor at AP Sciences Group,

[00:00:19] not to mention former White House Coronavirus Response Coordinator, along with Amy Carenza from ActivePure Medical.

[00:00:27] And together they're going to explore the groundbreaking results of ActivePure's continuous air and surface decontamination technology.

[00:00:37] One of the reasons I'm excited about this conversation is when I was doing a little research,

[00:00:41] I learned that they've achieved remarkable reductions in healthcare associated infections, including a whopping 96 to 99% drop in MRSA.

[00:00:52] So I want to learn more about how this chemical free technology works and how it provides continuous protection in occupied spaces.

[00:01:01] As this is a tech podcast, I also want to learn more about the science behind its advanced photohydraulic process

[00:01:08] and its potential applications in everything from healthcare, food production and even home environments.

[00:01:15] So could this innovation really reshape how we think about infection control?

[00:01:21] And why is embracing new technology so critical for global progress?

[00:01:26] Well, enough scene setting for me. Let's dive into this fascinating discussion and invite today's guests onto the podcast now.

[00:01:34] Well, a massive warm welcome to the show. I've got not one, but two speakers today.

[00:01:40] First of all, Dr. Burks, could you tell everyone listening a little about who you are and what you do?

[00:01:45] Hi to all your listeners. I'm Debbie Burks.

[00:01:47] I spent a lot of time working on pandemics all over the globe, Ebola, Zika, HIV, TB and malaria.

[00:01:54] Came back to the US for COVID and worked in the White House as the COVID response coordinator.

[00:02:00] And now, and just so privileged to be with a company that really wants to change how we look at indoor air.

[00:02:08] Fantastic. Well, thank you so much for taking the time to join me today.

[00:02:11] And Amy, we've got you joining me as well today. I'd love to hear more about you.

[00:02:15] Can you introduce yourself to the listeners too?

[00:02:18] Thank you, Neil. Yes, I'm Amy Corenza.

[00:02:20] I'm the Chief Commercial Officer at ActivePure.

[00:02:23] And for the last almost four years, I've had the great pleasure of working alongside Dr. Burks,

[00:02:30] our Chairman and CEO Joe Erso, in commercializing this technology, which is ActivePure, advanced photohydrolysis.

[00:02:39] And not only are we working to transform the way indoor air is managed and the interior quality of environments everywhere,

[00:02:50] but also the way that we keep loved ones and ourselves safer and healthier when we go into large healthcare organizations.

[00:03:00] So preventing hospital acquired infections is kind of our driving mission here.

[00:03:06] And I'm really looking forward to hearing more about that and indeed the role of technology and what that will play in that.

[00:03:12] And so much to talk about here.

[00:03:14] And Dr. Burks, I mean, your career has spanned global public health challenges from AIDS to COVID-19.

[00:03:21] How would you say these experiences have informed your approach to tackling healthcare associated infections with ActivePure's medical technology?

[00:03:31] Anything you can share around this? Because you've been on quite a journey here.

[00:03:34] I've been really privileged to see how innovative technologies are game changers.

[00:03:39] And that was true with HIV, with how we developed new tests and new treatments, and as we work on vaccines.

[00:03:49] But it really is clear that COVID really illustrated how important the private sector and technology is.

[00:03:58] And I know all around the globe, people know that we went from no tests to millions and millions of tests per day in less than three months because of the companies like Abbott and Roche and Hologic, who worked on this, and Cepheid.

[00:04:13] And then, of course, developing monoclonal antibodies for treatment, Rendesivir from Gilead, and then the vaccine.

[00:04:21] And that all happened in six to nine months.

[00:04:25] And that is all because all of the countries around the globe have really invested in next generation technology and science.

[00:04:33] And what ActivePure is saying, and it was really technology that was developed to really protect the indoor air in space.

[00:04:42] And they have a safe technology that really changes the safety of indoor air.

[00:04:49] And I think once you realize, and I think WHO finally came out and recognized that we have a lot of aerosolized viruses that remain suspended in air.

[00:04:59] And I know that people in your audience spent a lot of time disinfecting and wiping down surfaces only to find out now that these viruses are invisibly suspended in our air.

[00:05:12] We've focused on tobacco smoke and toxins, and we've really focused that way.

[00:05:18] But we've never focused on the infectious agents in our air.

[00:05:23] And I think that's what's so exciting to me about ActivePure is over the last four years, we've done the expensive and hard science that many of the other companies have not done to prove that this new technology changes the infectious quality of indoor air.

[00:05:41] And the golden rule in IT is you can only improve what you measure.

[00:05:46] And one of the things that put you on my radar was ActivePure's additional recent study highlighted a 96 to 99% reduction in MRSA and a 70% decrease in total healthcare associated infections, which is a hugely significant stat there.

[00:06:05] So can you share some insights into what makes this Induct Guardian Series Air decontamination system so effective and what it is compared to traditional methods?

[00:06:16] So thank you for talking about traditional methods, because traditional methods have limitations of leaning a lot on human need, human capacity.

[00:06:28] So, you know, when you've been in those hospital rooms, you've seen the people come in and clean the floors and they clean the floors like every eight hours or every four hours.

[00:06:37] You've seen people come in and write down surfaces.

[00:06:39] This technology, and it's a proprietary, fascinating technology that activates.

[00:06:46] We all know about electrons.

[00:06:48] If you remove electron, it becomes a very active substance, but is accelerated through a unique proprietary matrix that then creates millions of these, puts them out in the air, and they actually destroy fungal, bacterial, and virus coatings so they can't survive.

[00:07:06] And so what I love about it is it takes out the human factor.

[00:07:11] It works behind the scenes.

[00:07:14] It's completely safe.

[00:07:16] The company's done a whole series.

[00:07:18] You talked about the impact studies.

[00:07:20] The company's done a whole series of studies to show its safety.

[00:07:24] The FDA cleared it as a class two medical device.

[00:07:28] But I think everybody around the globe wants safe, continuous technology that they can count on and at the same time be highly effective.

[00:07:38] And I think this company is the first to show that its technology, by its continuous nature, actually changes the contamination on floors and surfaces, but also the air.

[00:07:53] And so we were able to show this dramatic decline in hospital-associated infections.

[00:07:59] And we all know how we're all concerned about antimicrobial resistance.

[00:08:03] You talked about MRSA.

[00:08:05] Thank you for mentioning that.

[00:08:07] That's methicillin-resistant staph aureus.

[00:08:11] All of our bugs are becoming more and more resistant, and we can't keep up with it by constantly trying to make better antibiotics.

[00:08:20] And the other part of this technology that I find particularly compelling is when you take an antibiotic, if it's a broad-spectrum antibiotic, which many of them are to be effective today, it wipes out your good bacteria.

[00:08:36] All your good bacteria that's on the skin and your good bacteria that's in the gut and the good bacteria that's in your mouth are important for us.

[00:08:44] And now we know that the human microbiome is so critical for preventing Parkinson's and cardiovascular disease.

[00:08:53] And here we are changing people's microbiome all the time in the hospital.

[00:08:59] This technology is effective without a pill.

[00:09:03] So these patients don't get infected.

[00:09:06] They don't have to take antibiotics.

[00:09:08] They don't change their microbiome.

[00:09:10] It decreases the length of their hospital stay, obviously.

[00:09:14] I mean, these people came in to get surgery and then end up with a post-surgical infection.

[00:09:18] They're in there 10 times longer than they should have been.

[00:09:22] And it's just so all of those pieces, shorter hospital stays, not changing your microbiome, and doing this in the background effectively to the air, the floor, and the surfaces in a safe way.

[00:09:36] And no one has to turn on the switch.

[00:09:38] It's in the ducts.

[00:09:40] It's running all the time.

[00:09:42] And that's the hospital system is in the ducts.

[00:09:45] But the same system can be put in nursing home rooms.

[00:09:48] It can be put in schools.

[00:09:49] It can be put in public places.

[00:09:52] It can be put in private physician practices and dental practices.

[00:09:56] People all over the United States have done that.

[00:09:58] And that's why we all want to be safe.

[00:10:01] And we want to know that the air that we breathe is safe.

[00:10:04] And I think this technology gets us there.

[00:10:08] And as this is a tech podcast, I love geeking out and maybe having a look under the hood and what makes it all possible.

[00:10:14] And from the outside looking in, the technology's reliance on advanced photohydrolysis seems to be one of the things that sets it apart.

[00:10:21] But can you explain how the process works and why it's such a game changer for continuous air and surface decontamination?

[00:10:28] So I'm going to start and then I'm going to call on Amy because this is the way I talk about it.

[00:10:34] Because I like to do really simple.

[00:10:37] It really, and I think many people remember when we were talking about COVID, we always talked about how it was safer to be outside.

[00:10:45] It's safer to be outside in many cases because the sun uses this technology to constantly purify our air.

[00:10:52] And so the sunlight is creating these same active agents that are in the air and cleaning surfaces for playgrounds and cleaning outside air for us to breathe.

[00:11:06] And Amy can speak specifically how this incredible technology works.

[00:11:12] So, Neil, you know, Mother Nature designs pretty awesome systems.

[00:11:17] And to Dr. Birx's point, what this technology does is replicate the exact same process that happens outside.

[00:11:27] Inside healthcare environments, this technology, it kind of goes together like peanut butter and jelly because in hospitals, you've got about 40% humidity content.

[00:11:38] Humidity is actively managed.

[00:11:40] And humidity is our raw ingredient here.

[00:11:42] Because what this technology does, as Dr. Birx said, if we're going to replicate the power of the sun, we have to try to replicate that amount of photonic or light-based energy.

[00:11:53] So the device has a UVC light, which many of your listeners are probably well aware of the germicidal properties of UVC light.

[00:12:02] But we use UVC light differently because it's just one element of a much different apparatus.

[00:12:08] We then take that UVC light.

[00:12:10] We amplify it with a proprietary catalyst.

[00:12:15] And the catalyst has proprietary coating with various semiconductors on it because at the end of the day, we want to augment that UVC light so that there is sufficient energy to break down that humidity content that is inside the airstream.

[00:12:31] And then once you do that, you are releasing into every inch of space, literally, these oxidative molecules.

[00:12:43] Hydrogen and oxygen-based, right?

[00:12:45] Because we're breaking down the water and the air.

[00:12:47] So hydrogen and oxygen-based oxidative molecules that then, as Dr. Birx explains, when you're intersecting with these microorganisms, you are able to permeate that membrane and essentially render that microorganism inert.

[00:13:04] But one thing I want to talk about, just because this truly does represent a paradigm shift in the way that indoor air is managed, because think about ICUs for a second.

[00:13:17] In the United States, ICUs are essentially regulated or, I should say, standardized by something called ASHRAE 170.

[00:13:26] It's a standard that dictates the amount of air that should be exchanged on a regular basis inside the space and the amount of filtration.

[00:13:37] So what level of efficiency?

[00:13:38] You won't find more air exchanges or denser filtration than you will in an ICU.

[00:13:46] But yet, we continue to see that these infections persist.

[00:13:52] And this is one of the reasons why, for the purposes of our seminal publication, we wanted to prove out the efficacy of the technology in an environment that is already doing the most that mechanical ventilation and mechanical filtration will allow you to do.

[00:14:10] But yet, there's a gap.

[00:14:12] And nobody would argue that there's a gap.

[00:14:14] The infections are proof there's a gap.

[00:14:16] And so by layering this technology and adding in an active means of remediation that's truly keeping up with the rate of contamination, because Dr. Burke says they're mopping the floors every eight hours.

[00:14:30] Okay, well, what happens the minute somebody walks in right after you've mopped the floor?

[00:14:34] It's like game over.

[00:14:35] Everything you just did has now been undermined by the contamination brought in by a caregiver.

[00:14:40] It is a never-ending cycle.

[00:14:42] So if we're truly going to meet the need, we have to have a remediation effort that works at the same rate as contamination does inside of these environments.

[00:14:52] And we've been able to do that.

[00:14:55] Fantastic.

[00:14:56] I love what you're doing here and how you're leveraging technology to make this possible, especially with the alarming rise of antimicrobial-resistant pathogens.

[00:15:04] And I'm curious, how can technologies like ActivePure further support healthcare facilities in mitigating some of these growing threats that we're seeing out there?

[00:15:15] Well, we all know and we should be all concerned about flu also.

[00:15:20] Also an aerosolized virus that remains persistent and suspended in air.

[00:15:26] And when we talk about flu or COVID or parainfluenza or RSV, all of these are killers to very young and very old.

[00:15:37] And H5N1 could potentially be avian flu, a killer across the board, like the Spanish flu was, although it's a different subtype.

[00:15:46] And so what is frustrating to me is every one of these pandemics illustrate a gap that we have in our response.

[00:15:55] Certainly COVID did that.

[00:15:57] What ActivePure is, is an answer to that air gap that we can't for viruses, bacteria, fungi that are always suspended in the air.

[00:16:08] So if you are seeing patients or you are walking into a supermarket or an elevator or a hallway or a bathroom, you're getting exposed to the last 10, 20, 50 people who are in that space.

[00:16:22] So even if no one is in that space at that time, you are breathing their air that they left behind.

[00:16:29] And what is exciting to me is this works continuously to remove those dangerous substances out of the air, augmenting what we've been doing with filtration at an energy conserving place, which we haven't really talked about.

[00:16:47] As our filters got more and more smaller micron, you have harder to push air through.

[00:16:54] And so this allows us to kill microbes without using more energy, like you have to have done with the filters or leaving things on continuously for air exchange.

[00:17:06] Or, as many people suggested, bring in more fresh air.

[00:17:10] Well, if you bring in more fresh air, you're bringing in hot air or cold air that you then have to use more energy.

[00:17:16] And so in the long run, this is going to not only be cost effective and have a high impact, it's going to protect our energy and our energy grids as we all try to be safe in the future.

[00:17:28] And I think what is frustrating to me as a physician that's worked around the world is, and I'm sure frustrating to many of your listeners that listen to tech, here we have a tech solution that is cost effective.

[00:17:41] And we've shown that it's cost effective, yet it's being slowly adapted and adopted first by Ochsnerd and then by some VA.

[00:17:52] And then where every hospital, with 6,000 hospitals, every hospital should have this.

[00:17:57] Every health clinic should have this.

[00:17:59] Every urgent care facility.

[00:18:01] I mean, we've all sat in those waiting rooms in urgent care.

[00:18:05] Okay, if people are coughing and sneezing, they're breathing.

[00:18:09] And if they're breathing, they are putting microbes into the air that you can't see.

[00:18:15] And so I think as DOD, and I came out of the military, I was in 29 years, microwaves came out of a discovery within the Department of Defense.

[00:18:27] We call that dual use.

[00:18:28] And so now that we know, everybody loves microwaves.

[00:18:32] You know, this technology, yes, it's new.

[00:18:36] But we've demonstrated it's effective.

[00:18:39] We've demonstrated that it's safe.

[00:18:41] And we've demonstrated that it can be utilized in an energy-saving, cost-effective manner to keep people healthy and decontaminate the invisible microbes in the air.

[00:18:52] Everybody should have this.

[00:18:53] I have it at home.

[00:18:54] It was in my daughter's grandchildren's preschool.

[00:18:57] It makes a big difference.

[00:19:00] We've shown that.

[00:19:01] Now it's about getting people, just like they started using smartphones, we need people to use SmartAir.

[00:19:08] And only ones that actually have demonstrated that they work.

[00:19:13] You know, there's a lot of people out there saying things.

[00:19:15] We don't say things that we don't have the papers, the science, and the data to back it up.

[00:19:23] And I think when it comes to any new technology, especially in healthcare, there will be a few questions to be asked around safety.

[00:19:30] And before you came on the podcast today, I was doing a little research.

[00:19:32] And one of the things that stood out to me was the recent safety study published by the POLS-1, which validated the safety of active pures technology for continuous use.

[00:19:44] How important is such validation for widespread adoption in healthcare environments and showing you get it in the 6,000 plus hospitals?

[00:19:54] You know, it was really critical to me, and I know it's critical to the CEO and Amy.

[00:20:00] These studies cost a lot of money.

[00:20:03] I'm just going to be frank.

[00:20:04] And they take time to do.

[00:20:05] It took us two to three years to do all of these studies.

[00:20:08] But what was important to us is when we talk about a new technology, that we can say to people, this technology has been shown to be safe.

[00:20:17] Here are the studies, published studies.

[00:20:19] Don't take our word for it.

[00:20:21] These are published studies that other scientists have reviewed.

[00:20:25] And they're clinical trial type studies that scientists have reviewed, showing clearly the remarkable safety and the remarkable impact.

[00:20:36] And the reason the safety was so important to us is because what makes this technology so unique is it's safe enough to be continuously running in occupied rooms.

[00:20:48] A lot of this technology, like UV germicidal technology, you can't be exposed to it.

[00:20:55] You can't look at it.

[00:20:58] You can't be exposed to it.

[00:20:59] There's a lot of technologies that are effective, but no people can be in the room.

[00:21:03] And I think as we start thinking about, and Europeans have been so good about thinking about the chemicals in the environment.

[00:21:11] These chemicals that we are using on surfaces and that we're using on floors also are getting into the air.

[00:21:18] This technology says, I don't need those chemicals.

[00:21:22] I'm using safe water molecules that have been activated to kill the membranes, to penetrate the membranes and kill the bacteria, the viruses and the funguses.

[00:21:35] And I think for your listeners, viruses are more difficult to make therapeutics.

[00:21:42] You know that with many of these viruses, you have to be diagnosed immediately and start taking the medicine, whether it's flu, 48 hours, whether it's COVID, the first five days.

[00:21:56] I mean, really, tackling viruses is difficult and our therapeutics are really lagging behind.

[00:22:03] This says, don't worry about that because we've eliminated those viruses and bacteria out of the environment.

[00:22:11] And I think to me, a safe technology that doesn't require human intervention, just requires it to be on, is really remarkable.

[00:22:23] And then to be able to say, when you walk in this room, our air is safe.

[00:22:30] We all know the stories of the grandparents who were infected by a grandchild unbeknowingly, because many are asymptomatic with RSV or flu or COVID.

[00:22:44] And they ended up either being hospitalized or hospitalized and dying.

[00:22:49] This is particularly personal to me.

[00:22:51] My grandmother at 13 brought home the Spanish flu in 2019 to her family.

[00:23:05] And her mother, who was three days postpartum and with a newborn baby, succumbed to flu.

[00:23:11] She lived with that her whole life.

[00:23:13] It is a tragedy.

[00:23:15] And now this is why this is personal and important to me.

[00:23:19] Here is science and technology that will eliminate that or very significantly reduce that risk for everybody across the globe.

[00:23:28] And Amy, just to bring you into this, anything else that excites you around?

[00:23:33] Not just getting the technology right, but ensuring that it's safe too.

[00:23:37] A lot of this excites me because with the safety publication, which by the way, we do not have peer technologies that have demonstrated safety to that level.

[00:23:51] And across the board, from our publication in the Journal of Infection Control to this publication in PLUS1, the designs of our study have been all about how do we go further than the status quo?

[00:24:05] And how do we prove through replicating our findings and through allowing longitudinal, you know, a significant longitudinal data set to prove that this isn't chance or luck or any of those things?

[00:24:18] But one of the things that excites me the most about now proving this safety is the implications for our global food supply.

[00:24:27] And, you know, Dr. Birx talked a lot about what the devastating consequences of broad-spectrum antibiotics.

[00:24:35] But as we all know, we grow food where antibiotics is a requirement because of how the animals, the proteins, are housed leading up to their ultimate harvesting.

[00:24:48] And there are implications to this that are still unfolding.

[00:24:53] And Dr. Birx and I talk about this a lot.

[00:24:56] But you also hear more acute headlines that can be terrifying from avian flu in now milk supplies, right, to the ongoing surprises that we're getting where things that aren't even a protein, like, you know, contaminated onions and cucumbers, things that now have E. coli.

[00:25:16] And you go, oh, my goodness.

[00:25:18] Like, how difficult is it for us to keep the environments where we process food clean and safe?

[00:25:24] And the people who work in those environments clean and safe?

[00:25:28] So what we've now demonstrated across these really high-acuity healthcare spaces where we have done specific pathogen tests of some of the most resistant organisms, like Candida auris, which is a very drug-resistant and very fatal fungi,

[00:25:49] to Acinobacter bactyls, which are terrifying for any healthcare organization when those infections are found, where now we have the confidence of knowing, A, this is a technology that is pathogen agnostic because we're able to get the same results and we're able to replicate our findings regardless of the microorganisms that are in the environment.

[00:26:14] So that is huge.

[00:26:15] So that is huge.

[00:26:16] We also know that the safety is there.

[00:26:18] So where else in our world, besides healthcare, do we have the sort of mixed set of decks there of needing something very safe and highly efficacious against a broad spectrum of pathogens?

[00:26:33] It's food.

[00:26:34] I think what's exciting and what Amy was speaking to is the technology that we have shown to protect humans in indoor spaces, we are now showing protects piglets and chicks and our food supply.

[00:26:51] And so this technology can be used by our farmers around the globe who are growing chicks and piglets for consumption and processing food for human consumption.

[00:27:04] Imagine having this safe technology that we've demonstrated the safety who's protecting our food supply.

[00:27:11] So we think that this technology is unlimited in its application, just like we all learned from how to use microwaves.

[00:27:19] We think this technology should be in every home, every hospital and every food producing organization from growing of the animals to processing of the animals to processing of our vegetables and food.

[00:27:33] So it's very exciting for us.

[00:27:35] We don't see any limitations to this technology.

[00:27:38] We see only upside for the people around the world.

[00:27:41] And of course, what we're talking about here is continuous automated decontamination that removes the human factor and infection control, which feels like a massive step.

[00:27:52] How do you see that innovation reshaping, let's say, standard practices in hospitals and indeed beyond?

[00:28:00] You know, thank you for saying that, Neil, because for your audience, they should be demanding this technology in their health care delivery system.

[00:28:08] It's cost effective.

[00:28:10] The hospitals can install this and within the first six months have return on their investment because of the hospital-associated infections that they will prevent that are highly costly to hospitals.

[00:28:24] So they're costly to hospitals, but humanly, the human cost of these are just phenomenal.

[00:28:30] I just remember a lot of people over 60 and 70 that ended up with these complications ended up in months of rehab to really build back their strength to where they were.

[00:28:41] So we think this technology is limitless.

[00:28:44] We've proven its safety.

[00:28:46] We've proven its efficacy.

[00:28:47] We think that now that it's in the scientific literature, hospitals should be required to really have this technology in place.

[00:28:57] And for our food producers out there, please look at this.

[00:29:00] This is a technology that you can utilize in a highly effective way in your indoor spaces.

[00:29:08] And again, before you came on the podcast, I was looking at a few study results to familiarize myself with what you're doing here.

[00:29:15] And one that stood out was, I think it was the Oshina Health Centre at Lexington Veterans Affairs Healthcare System.

[00:29:21] And they both demonstrated sustained reductions in infection rates over a month's use.

[00:29:26] But I mean, what do these findings and everything that you encountered here, what did that reveal about the maybe the long term impact of active pure technology?

[00:29:35] Anything you can share around that?

[00:29:37] Well, you know, that's the great thing about this because it utilizes the power of the sun with these what we would call hydroxyl and free radicals that are safe in the environment because we breathe them all the time outside.

[00:29:50] What it's saying is this is a technology that has cumulative results over time because you can utilize it safely forever.

[00:30:00] So many of these studies are out multiple years now.

[00:30:03] And just remember, you know, because it takes out the human factor.

[00:30:08] It's running continuously, continuously improving the air and surface contamination in every hallway, every room, every nurse's station, every physician charting station.

[00:30:20] Everything is benefiting from this technology.

[00:30:24] And so I think we all know how many people in our health care providers carry asymptomatic infections into those rooms every day, whether they're colonized with specific bacteria like MRSA or whether they are asymptomatically infected with COVID or flu.

[00:30:43] We know a lot of these respiratory infections in normal individuals can be completely asymptomatic.

[00:30:48] But their very active breathing in those rooms is contaminating that room to a very vulnerable individual in that system.

[00:30:57] And so without chemicals in a safe way, we're actually changing indoor air forever.

[00:31:04] And I think Oxnard really took a chance on this new technology because we didn't have the scientific paper when they agreed to install these.

[00:31:14] But they were so impressed.

[00:31:15] They're expanding the installation through many of their health care delivery facilities.

[00:31:20] And that's what we think all 6,000 hospitals and urgent care should be doing throughout the United States.

[00:31:27] And Amy, again, to bring you in on this, as someone that's right at the heart of the technology, there must be a lot that excites you.

[00:31:34] But what are they, anything in particular around the long-term impact of active pure technology from the kind of conversations that you're having here?

[00:31:43] Well, yes, that's a great question.

[00:31:46] And as Dr. Birx indicated, you know, the two hospitals that were featured in our publication with the Journal of Infection Control,

[00:31:55] we continue to get new data from them.

[00:31:58] Because while we installed initially in one ICU in each hospital, and at the time we went to publication,

[00:32:05] I think we had about 60, a little over 60 months of data from both hospitals combined.

[00:32:12] So we had what I would consider a longitudinal data set at the time of publication.

[00:32:18] But that was over a year ago.

[00:32:20] And we haven't taken the equipment out.

[00:32:22] So we continue to get new information.

[00:32:24] As Dr. Birx said, we're fortunate that with Ochsner, we have now expanded significantly across their health system.

[00:32:31] And so now what we're doing is we're asking different questions.

[00:32:35] And I will give just this little bit of suspense for your listeners.

[00:32:43] You heard it here first on this podcast.

[00:32:45] We anticipate in 2025 a brief report to essentially accompany the publication,

[00:32:56] the American Journal of Infection Control publication,

[00:32:58] where we've essentially gone back and done some additional analyses around these departments where we are installed,

[00:33:05] asking new questions.

[00:33:06] And specifically, asking new questions about how we are able to prevent infections with multidrug-resistant organisms.

[00:33:14] Because right where we started this conversation,

[00:33:17] the global threat that we all face around antimicrobial resistance is a problem we feel is solvable.

[00:33:25] And we need to prove that.

[00:33:27] So we've got the data now.

[00:33:28] We're going back.

[00:33:29] And so anyway, stay tuned for that.

[00:33:31] We hope that will be coming out in 2025.

[00:33:34] And the longer we can work with health systems,

[00:33:36] our promise to the community is that what we learn,

[00:33:39] we will report back so that we can all work together to solve these problems.

[00:33:44] I do love a good teaser.

[00:33:46] I'll be looking forward to reading more about that next year.

[00:33:49] Dr. Birx mentioned a few moments ago.

[00:33:52] But Amy, anything else that you see this technology could scale to broader applications,

[00:33:58] even beyond traditional healthcare?

[00:34:00] Because we're all at that time of the year where we're starting to think bigger and differently about doing things.

[00:34:05] Do you see this outside of healthcare?

[00:34:07] Any other examples this tech would be suited?

[00:34:10] Absolutely.

[00:34:11] I think this should be in every indoor space.

[00:34:14] This should be ubiquitous in the built environment.

[00:34:17] And something that we would need a whole other podcast episode to talk about is the energy argument.

[00:34:24] Dr. Birx hinted at it.

[00:34:25] And we believe that in terms of solving global dilemmas, right?

[00:34:31] We know we've got a big one here around pathogens in the environment.

[00:34:35] But our other big one is how are we stewards of these finite energy resources amidst a growing global population

[00:34:46] and a global rising temperature that is only going to demand more and more energy resources.

[00:34:54] We feel this technology will be key to that story because so much of where we use energy in the built environment,

[00:35:01] about 40% in whether you're looking at commercial or residential buildings,

[00:35:06] about 40% of energy intensity is just keeping ourselves comfortable.

[00:35:10] And I'm not suggesting we do away with that.

[00:35:12] We all like that, right?

[00:35:13] But if you're going to keep yourself comfortable, the way in which you do it matters.

[00:35:19] And this technology offers interior environments the ability to recycle and use interior air longer

[00:35:26] with the health and quality of ventilation but without the energy demands of ventilation.

[00:35:35] So having a ventilation equivalency in an era where we are going to have to get a lot more efficient about energy

[00:35:44] is a whole other podcast episode.

[00:35:47] So we're happy to have that conversation anytime.

[00:35:51] Awesome.

[00:35:51] It sounds like we need to get you both back on next year to discuss that.

[00:35:55] And, of course, we are in a period of so many big changes at the moment in the world.

[00:36:00] And in the U.S., Robert F. Kennedy Jr.'s nomination to lead the Department of Health and Human Services

[00:36:06] has sparked significant public health discussions.

[00:36:09] How do you view this development and what opportunities or challenges do you foresee

[00:36:14] for healthcare innovation under this new leadership?

[00:36:18] Well, I'll speak to that briefly.

[00:36:20] I think he is one of the first individuals to be considered to run HHS that has been concerned about our additives in our food,

[00:36:32] our chemicals in our food, our antibiotics in their food that are exposing our children to risk.

[00:36:38] We have many additives that Europeans don't allow in their food to protect them.

[00:36:43] So we think this type of technology that doesn't use chemicals and preserves the normal microbiome

[00:36:51] could be very exciting to HHS and all of the facilities and healthcare facilities that they fund,

[00:36:58] because CMS, our main provider, is under HHS.

[00:37:04] So we're excited that he will come in with new views of how to use today's technology to not disrupt what we know is critical for human life.

[00:37:15] And that is decreasing the amount of chemical and additive exposure

[00:37:19] and decreasing the chemicals that are used in the indoor built space,

[00:37:23] that when we breathe in or we touch and it is absorbed through our skin,

[00:37:27] this technology eliminates the need for that.

[00:37:30] And I think to me that I think he will look at this in new ways.

[00:37:35] I know that on the concern side, there are individuals that are worried about his approach to childhood vaccines.

[00:37:42] He has said in recent discussions that he is not going to limit childhood vaccine utilization,

[00:37:48] but he wants every parent to know what the risk benefits are,

[00:37:52] which I think as a parent, I want to know what the risk benefits are.

[00:37:56] And I certainly explain that to my children and to my grandchildren.

[00:38:00] They're, of course, all immunized because I understand the risk benefits.

[00:38:03] But everybody should be able to understand the risk benefits.

[00:38:06] So if we empower people, if we educate them about all of these issues,

[00:38:13] I found humans around the world to be able to understand very complex issues.

[00:38:19] And they get the nuances.

[00:38:22] And I think sometimes we talk down to people.

[00:38:24] I think we don't explain everything in detail.

[00:38:27] We don't talk about what we don't know.

[00:38:29] And I'm hoping that this will be an inflection point where we really change how we talk to each other about health issues.

[00:38:37] 100% with you there.

[00:38:39] And I think there is so much polarization in the world at the moment and nuance and context are often lost.

[00:38:44] So it'll be interesting how this takes shape.

[00:38:47] And for anyone listening wanting to find out more information about anything we talked about today,

[00:38:52] where would you like to point them listening if they're a healthcare leader or just wanting to find out more information?

[00:38:58] Where would you like to point everyone listening to learn more?

[00:39:01] ActivePure website or, Neil, I'll tell you what, I can leave you my contact information.

[00:39:07] If folks are wanting to talk directly to ask the hard questions, I would be happy to talk to any of your listeners.

[00:39:16] So I can provide that information.

[00:39:18] Awesome.

[00:39:18] Well, I will add a link to everything so people can find that information.

[00:39:24] And look to start a few conversations around this.

[00:39:27] Get people talking about the technology, replacing harmful chemicals.

[00:39:32] I think that's something that we'd all like to see more of.

[00:39:36] But I think this is a conversation that we should continue into 2025.

[00:39:40] It sounds like there's going to be a few big announcements, a few teasers that you drop there.

[00:39:44] So we'll get you both back on next year to learn more.

[00:39:46] But thank you so much to both of you for taking the time to sit down with me today and talking about this important topic.

[00:39:52] Thanks so much.

[00:39:53] Thank you, Neil.

[00:39:54] Wow.

[00:39:55] Thank you so much for joining me today for this inspiring conversation with Dr. Deborah Birx and Amy Carenza about ActivePure's revolutionary air decontamination technology.

[00:40:07] From reducing healthcare-associated infections to its potential for energy-efficient air management.

[00:40:13] I think it's clear that this innovation has the power to impact industries far beyond healthcare.

[00:40:19] But as Dr. Birx reminded us today, I think our natural aversion to risk often holds back the adoption of transformative technologies.

[00:40:28] But what do you think?

[00:40:30] Are we ready to embrace new approaches to infection control?

[00:40:34] Or does scepticism still stand in the way?

[00:40:37] I think anything that removes chemicals from the equation has got to be a good thing.

[00:40:41] But this is not my area of expertise.

[00:40:44] It's probably yours if you're listening to this episode.

[00:40:47] So share your thoughts by emailing me, techbrogwriteroutlook.com, LinkedIn, just at Neil C. Hughes.

[00:40:54] Let me know your thoughts on this one.

[00:40:56] And remember, join me again tomorrow here on Tech Talks Daily for more stories about technologies, how they're shaping our future, and the real-world problems that they're solving.

[00:41:07] Hopefully I'll get to speak with you all again tomorrow.

[00:41:09] So I'll speak with you all then.

[00:41:11] Bye for now.